WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:01.260 align:middle line:90% 00:00:01.260 --> 00:00:03.030 align:middle line:84% And so formally, it doesn't [INAUDIBLE].. 00:00:03.030 --> 00:00:05.460 align:middle line:84% Could you talk a little bit about the impossible thing 00:00:05.460 --> 00:00:06.220 align:middle line:90% to talk about? 00:00:06.220 --> 00:00:09.540 align:middle line:84% I mean, how do you go from material and notes 00:00:09.540 --> 00:00:13.830 align:middle line:84% and initial energies to arriving at that point where form is 00:00:13.830 --> 00:00:16.220 align:middle line:90% beginning to announce itself? 00:00:16.220 --> 00:00:18.345 align:middle line:84% Could you talk about how that process works for you 00:00:18.345 --> 00:00:21.380 align:middle line:90% and how you get there? 00:00:21.380 --> 00:00:21.890 align:middle line:90% It didn't. 00:00:21.890 --> 00:00:24.190 align:middle line:90% I didn't use to get there. 00:00:24.190 --> 00:00:27.380 align:middle line:84% I mean, I was a one-trick pony for a very long time, 00:00:27.380 --> 00:00:30.770 align:middle line:84% but I have a very restive sensibility. 00:00:30.770 --> 00:00:37.970 align:middle line:84% And so I got bored with myself, and I started trying things. 00:00:37.970 --> 00:00:38.960 align:middle line:90% I found that I did-- 00:00:38.960 --> 00:00:42.170 align:middle line:84% I liked the risk more than I liked being bored. 00:00:42.170 --> 00:00:45.680 align:middle line:84% And so I started acquiring a lot of skills, 00:00:45.680 --> 00:00:50.150 align:middle line:84% little technical skills, then figuring out 00:00:50.150 --> 00:00:54.050 align:middle line:84% what's right for a certain kind of material. 00:00:54.050 --> 00:00:57.410 align:middle line:84% That's a trick, I just, I flail around in. 00:00:57.410 --> 00:01:01.690 align:middle line:84% I can't do it the same way twice, or if I could, 00:01:01.690 --> 00:01:02.620 align:middle line:90% I wouldn't want to. 00:01:02.620 --> 00:01:05.530 align:middle line:84% Once I've learned it, I don't want to do it over. 00:01:05.530 --> 00:01:08.530 align:middle line:84% Even though I can use some of those techniques, 00:01:08.530 --> 00:01:12.940 align:middle line:84% I don't want to compose the same way. 00:01:12.940 --> 00:01:18.700 align:middle line:84% And I try things, and I try not to let it harden on me 00:01:18.700 --> 00:01:21.910 align:middle line:84% before I'm somewhat satisfied with the working methods 00:01:21.910 --> 00:01:25.530 align:middle line:84% so that if I need to reinvent it, I can. 00:01:25.530 --> 00:01:28.380 align:middle line:84% And I'm at that point when I'm trying 00:01:28.380 --> 00:01:31.740 align:middle line:84% to keep that concrete boiling around in there so it doesn't 00:01:31.740 --> 00:01:34.265 align:middle line:84% harden on me, because I'm not satisfied 00:01:34.265 --> 00:01:36.085 align:middle line:90% with the way it's going. 00:01:36.085 --> 00:01:39.970 align:middle line:90% 00:01:39.970 --> 00:01:44.110 align:middle line:84% There are people who have very fixed ideas of form in advance, 00:01:44.110 --> 00:01:45.880 align:middle line:84% and they do that very successfully. 00:01:45.880 --> 00:01:49.520 align:middle line:84% And there are people who also find their form very early on, 00:01:49.520 --> 00:01:53.980 align:middle line:84% and that's their form, like someone, say Creeley, 00:01:53.980 --> 00:01:56.710 align:middle line:90% very early on. 00:01:56.710 --> 00:02:02.290 align:middle line:84% And what they have to say can be satisfied on those terms. 00:02:02.290 --> 00:02:06.670 align:middle line:84% And then there are people who can never quite settle down, 00:02:06.670 --> 00:02:08.240 align:middle line:90% which is more the way I am. 00:02:08.240 --> 00:02:10.979 align:middle line:84% And I don't think one is better than the other. 00:02:10.979 --> 00:02:15.335 align:middle line:84% I think it depends on your own, sort of, stripe of obsession. 00:02:15.335 --> 00:02:18.327 align:middle line:90% 00:02:18.327 --> 00:02:20.160 align:middle line:84% I mean, sometimes I think people might do it 00:02:20.160 --> 00:02:22.650 align:middle line:84% for the wrong reasons, they might settle into a form. 00:02:22.650 --> 00:02:25.330 align:middle line:90% 00:02:25.330 --> 00:02:28.410 align:middle line:84% Maybe the reason doesn't have quite enough integrity, 00:02:28.410 --> 00:02:32.407 align:middle line:84% has more to do with getting approval for doing something 00:02:32.407 --> 00:02:32.990 align:middle line:90% a certain way. 00:02:32.990 --> 00:02:36.420 align:middle line:90% And so they keep doing-- 00:02:36.420 --> 00:02:42.030 align:middle line:90% but I think that some-- 00:02:42.030 --> 00:02:45.440 align:middle line:84% You know, Ashbery, in a sense has written a similar poem 00:02:45.440 --> 00:02:47.630 align:middle line:90% in terms of-- 00:02:47.630 --> 00:02:50.735 align:middle line:84% but I wouldn't say that he stopped-- 00:02:50.735 --> 00:02:53.590 align:middle line:84% I mean, I might think that he might have tried a little less, 00:02:53.590 --> 00:02:55.380 align:middle line:90% but this is what he does. 00:02:55.380 --> 00:02:58.120 align:middle line:90% 00:02:58.120 --> 00:03:03.250 align:middle line:84% I wouldn't say that his form has stopped moving there. 00:03:03.250 --> 00:03:05.361 align:middle line:84% Even though, there are you know, certain-- 00:03:05.361 --> 00:03:09.030 align:middle line:84% an Ashbery poem is recognizably an Ashbery poem. 00:03:09.030 --> 00:03:12.460 align:middle line:90% 00:03:12.460 --> 00:03:14.420 align:middle line:84% A Mei-mei Berssenbrugge poem is certainly 00:03:14.420 --> 00:03:18.830 align:middle line:84% recognizable Mei-mei Berssenbrugge. 00:03:18.830 --> 00:03:21.770 align:middle line:84% But it doesn't look like she's [INAUDIBLE].. 00:03:21.770 --> 00:03:23.220 align:middle line:90% It's really glyphed. 00:03:23.220 --> 00:03:26.520 align:middle line:90% 00:03:26.520 --> 00:03:28.970 align:middle line:90% It's not cut into a rock yet. 00:03:28.970 --> 00:03:31.000 align:middle line:90%